chalky

Hi to all,

have been hanging around CGarchitect for a while but haven't had a reason to post before as most of my 3D is in-house (architectural practice) and they are fairly happy with the images I produce but recently I have done some work for a third party in my own time.
My question is (I hope someone can help), I have been asked if I could forward a copy of the model I have produced and I was wondering what the copyright issues were regarding the actual model including textures, lights, cameras etc.. I appreciate that the firm I have produced the images for have copyright on the design but was wondering if there are any rules regarding the 3d model.

Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks.

mbr

You can try a search for this, it's been discussed.

Basically, unless it's in the initial contract/agreement, I wouldn't send the file along. There are lot of things that could be yours, like textures, etc., that took work to make and I wouldn't give them out unless it's paid for.

I've had clients that insisted on the model from the beginning, but most don't have a use for it. It's safe to assume that they want the model for their own use (like more renderings without paying you), so I wouldn't give something away for free. If they insist, or think it's absurd for you not to (explain it all to them without forcing anything), then you have to make the call if you want to keep them happy.

You coudl just send them a stripped out model, with no textures, lighting, cameras, etc. If they asked for the 'model', then you could give them the 'model'. It's work to put it all together, eitherway, and you should be compensated for it (unless it was part of the agreement).

Chad Warner

Most the time its up to you (or your firm) whether or not to hand over the 3d model. The only thing you would need to be concerned with otherwise would be textures/models/etc. that were purchased. You wouldn't be able to transfer them to someone else.

-Chad

GI Dude

I allways give away the model, this is because, it's done for that project in particular, for example, an office building, and we have no futher use for it.

I give away the model, what i don't give away (even for a fee) is the whole max file, because it contains textures, entourage, and ligthing, that took me days to create... they ask for the model for a very simple reason, they need to keep working on it, they need to generate 2d elevations, sections, or more renderings, and they don't want to pay more than they already did... so i do the following...

I give them a 3d model "as is"... naked, meaning, that is only the 3d model, layered (autocad format), no lights, no materials, no RPCs or any other 3d models, remember that you have the right to use all the textures and models that you purchased, but you don't have the rigth to give them away with your model, that is ilegal.

They will ask for the rest of the "model" it allways happens, and it's very anoying, because they don't understand our work, so here's what we do...

I allways write a statement of copyright telling the cilent that we keep the rights over the images in order to improve them, and using for our own purposes (brochures, internet, other media) we ALLWAYS mention the autor(s) of that project

example:

Alex's House, Guzman Architecs, Image by Alter Ego Multimedia.,

Regarding the rigths over the model (they designed it) however, we state that the 3d model is included on a cd rom "as is" and it's property of the client, meaning that they can use it, modify the design, whatever, since it was their idea...

As for the rest of the scene, all the 3d models, and textures, whose rights belongs to their respective creators, and indeed we use under permission of them (that's why we purchase a license)... a little bit complicated, however it works fine for us...

A few hints...

1 Don't you ever give away textures, models, and other stuff that didn't created... this is considered piracy...

2 Don't give away your complete model rigged o or with the cameras, and lighting set up... they can hire some one else cheaper to modify it, because it's al done ( they will) one of my very very first job consisted to modify previous 3d models, let the others work as hard as you did...

3 Get everything writen on paper, work with a lawyer if you need, i allways have al least two statements one of copyrighting / licensing of all the images and video footage, and other for privacy /confidentiality of the project, menaning that we have privileged information and we are not using that information foy any other purpose but our work.

4 If you publish any image, or include a video in a Demo CD, ALLWAYS include the name of the designer Firm, i allways do the "fine print" inluding the name of the designer firm...

5 don't you ever work or give away copyrighted logos, or mention brands unless you have permision for it...

6 last but not least, write a contract / job order including the two statements
metined above, remember, protect yourself, get everything written on paper so you don't have any problems...

If you need more information:

Copyright Law

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/h...sup_01_17.html

Understanding What you are selling / offering

http://www.cgarchitect.com/upclose/article2_DW.asp

http://www.cgarchitect.com/upclose/article3_DW.asp

Understanding Copyrighting and licensing

http://www.weblawresources.com/copyright_art.htm

http://www.weblawresources.com/Copyr...ight-forms.htm

http://www.weblawresources.com/Copyr...-when-file.htm

http://www.weblawresources.com/Copyr...ght-how-to.htm

Hope it helps...



My english sucks...

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Alex Guzman

GI Dude

UK law for Copyright

http://www.patent.gov.uk/about/consu...s/eccopyright/

http://www.copyrightservice.co.uk/co..._copyright_law

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Alex Guzman

chalky

Many thanks for your comments.

My suspicions were that I should only hand over the stripped down model because as has been mentioned, most of the textures were from CD's that I have purchased and I've put the time in setting up lights etc..

Thanks Alex for the links they make useful reading and your English is infinitely better than my Spanish.

Again thanks for the help.

crazy homeless guy

not only the textures from cd's, but you should also protect the tetures you hand crafted yourself. if you are like me, you spend a lot of time making high quality textures, and then yuo use them over and over in projects. the firm that made paid you to construct the model, didn't necessarily pay you to make your own textures.

usually i would say don't hand over the model, but GI dude has some good points.

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travis schmiesing

GI Dude

I agree, you sohuld keep your textures, after all you spend a lot of time doing them...

cheers

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Alex Guzman

Sawyer

I would be wray of giving away the file. I have never done it and it just makes me uncomfortable. I have worked from other peoples (usually in house drafters models) and it is usually really horrible. I would be afraid that I would model the building do a rendering and they would aske for the model make changes give it back to me and have me rerender it and everything is messed up and modeled wrong. Basically it comes down to you are giving out a file of work you created that has your name on it and letting other people do whatever they want with it. But it seems Alex does this a lot and han't had problems.

GI Dude

Why should not give away the file?

I work with architects in the very early stages of the proyect, as a designer i understand how much can help having the entire 3d model for developing 2d view, sections, and even plan views...

If they can play with it, later, they conme with fresh ideas... a new roof, new materials, etc.

I never work with other files than mine (i did at some point, but it was easy money back then) the reason is very simple, most of the people has its own way to model, it is a waste of time to fix someonelse's mess... so when they comback with changes, i charge more if i have to work with someone else model, or mine modified for some else... it's a small fee but i do charge it, same for the renders...

I keep all the versions of the 3d models, even the earliest, also i try to get involved in all the phases of the design, some times, we offer a facade proposal, that we work along with the client (architect or not) we develop 3d CG models, 2d plans, and even a 3d scale model made of wood... at the end we get involved in the proyect so much that most of the time, we design facades, and we sell that design, so later the renderings come part of that proposal...

So giving away the model, becomes more like a part of the attention to that client in specific, most of our clients don't ask for it, since they hire us for doing all the work... other clients allways ask for it... we give it to them and later they comeback for the whole package... so it's basically customer care...

It is a risk as some on else would say, but in my experice, it will get you in a better position... almost nobody does it, when asked for it, they give the model for a fee, later you can use it as an advantage... something you can negotiate, i will charge for the model of course, but its included in the first proposal, maybe it won't be cheap, but at least, i give you the whole model, may be the oter guy don't so you have a nice argument to negotiate your fee... remember (at this point i must be very anoying) write it down in your proposal...

Good luck.

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Alex Guzman