Rendering Community

[litleboy]

Lets say you can get 50% of the freelances around the world to agree. the other 50% will have better chances to get the jobs if they can offer the same quality, but still I think if there is even a small % to agree to set standards, the rest will follow in some way.

in other idea. will be nice to put my computer to work for other like a remote render farm, and I will get paid for the frames pixels produced, like the SETI network.

[RyanSpaulding]

I guess I just don't see how this works. I don't know how you'd get the freelancers everywhere to agree on a price...costs of living are too far apart...and although Eddie says that companies may pay someone $40 per hour vs $10, I'm skeptical. Obviously, a westerner will get hosed in the $ process because we have a higher cost of living.

Again, without restricting regions, I don't know how this works. The original concept with Ernest I thought was to see if INsourcing works. The 'IN' is an intregal part...because in OUTsourcing, we're discussing the 'OUT' part and how to combat it...keeping it INside the us/uk where cost of living forces a higher wage to be asked was. what I believe, the original target.

As a us/uk based operation, you could get freelancers to agree to a somewhat similar wage...there wouldn't be any of this $300 per full rendering nonsense that averages out to less than $10 per hour...ruining the value in the professionals in the industry.

The value would be in:

1. A network of artists who could band together to service larger projects, quickly and effectively
2. No language barriers...to a less extent, no time zone barriers.
3. The value of supporting local artists, jobs, and local economy...which are being destroyed by sending jobs overseas.
4. Then ability to set a more reasonable rate threshold.

[EddieLeon]

Originally Posted by WAcky

I like the sound of it, I need work and I'm happy to do bits and pieces if it filles up the holes in my schedule...

But im in aus...

That's ok. You can be anywhere.
I like the idea that we can divide projects into "bits and pieces". The cool thing about this is that artist can focus on what they like doing best (modeling, lighting, animation, motion graphics, or editing, etc). Some can even focus on sales and marketing...

The idea of a pier to pier remote render farm would be amazing also. This could really level the playing field for everyone!

[EddieLeon]

Originally Posted by RyanSpaulding

...and although Eddie says that companies may pay someone $40 per hour vs $10, I'm skeptical. Obviously, a westerner will get hosed in the $ process because we have a higher cost of living.

Yes...There will always be a market for the artists that charge $40+. Keep in mind, the cost of renderings are peanuts compared to the total cost of a development project. I have a client that essentially paid us $24,000 for 1 rendering. It was a unique situation because the client gave us very little time, expected high-quality, and it was a complex project (oh wait, that's all of our projects). Anyways, they paid and came back for more.

My point is that we need to learn to play the market and not fight against ourselves. Your market can bare $40+ if you focus on your client's needs and service them like no one else can. How and where you get your work produced is secondary as long as it is what you promised to your client. Get it?

[znotlin]

So what you're saying Eddie is that the ends justify the means?

That business should have no conscience, and that if someone else is willing to take the risk with illegal software and miserable working conditions that it is OK for you to know that and still hire them if they are the cheapest?

BTW in no way am I trying to imply this is the condition in all developing world shops, I am just trying to gauge where your fervent capitalism stops.

That said, if you are using your investment in China, to get the ear of the Chinese government to advocate for better human rights, and environmental change than god bless you, you are part of the solution.

[vizwhiz]

how about dividing up The workflow something along The Lines of
To create a matrix, like

Imperial vs Metric
Exterior vs Interior
Site
Bldg
Landscape

1. modeling
2. materials/lighting/rendering
3. photoshop/after post/composition

software, must have a TEAM with compatible softwares
rendering capability, rendering farm

and DONT FORGET someone has To GET THE CLIENT 1st
Then decipher what The HELL THeY WANT and Then outline

The workflow

distribute The workflow To who is AVAILABLE
and go from There

other possible issues To consider
FTP site, preliminary client approval
contract issues and of course $ per each person participating

++++

just a conceptual idea of how To do a project

how would you do This?

[EddieLeon]

Originally Posted by znotlin

I am just trying to gauge where your fervent capitalism stops.

Have you ever been to China? I own a small studio there. It's definitely not a sweat shop. It has air-conditioning!

Kidding aside, it's actually in a "Class A" building in Shenzhen, China. It even has a Rolls Royce and Ferrari dealership on the first floor. My point is not to brag. It's just that I have been to China a few times and I know first hand that a lot of people there live very well. In fact, I bet most of the Chinese artists that are competing with you live very well also.

I would also like to point out that in less than 5 years I have created a company that employees over 40 employees in the US of A. They are all American citizens just like you and me. They are paid well, I provide them a very nice work environment, and they rarely work overtime.

The way I like to approach my obstacles is that I turn negatives into positives. The glass is always 1/2 Full.

I noticed in your profile that you are a teacher. I guess that means you like to learn. So, let me suggest a good business book for you. It's called:

Blue Ocean Strategy: How to Create Uncontested Market Space and Make Competition Irrelevant

The point of this book is that you should avoid "Red Oceans" which are battlegrounds with your competitors. Instead you should focus on standing apart from them and find new and better ways to do business.

I think good business practice is what we should be focusing on now. Not alarmist rhetoric. Anyway, it's your choice whether you want to listen and act or not.

[znotlin]

I don't think I asked you about your shop, or insinuated you ran a sweat shop, I asked about the edges of what reasonable capitalism is in your eyes? For instance, illegal software, is it OK to make money using, or knowingly hire someone using it?

I also wonder what kind of responsibilities you believe a business might have over just making money. Especially when they are investing in an area whose government has poor human rights, and environmental records.

Did I miss your answer to those questions, or do I have to read the book to get to those?

[EddieLeon]

Originally Posted by znotlin

I don't think I asked you about your shop, or insinuated you ran a sweat shop, I asked about the edges of what reasonable capitalism is in your eyes? For instance, illegal software, is it OK to make money using, or knowingly hire someone using it?

I also wonder what kind of responsibilities you believe a business might have over just making money. Especially when they are investing in an area whose government has poor human rights, and environmental records.

Did I miss your answer to those questions, or do I have to read the book to get to those?

Hhmm....you want to turn this thread into a political discussion? This is CGArchitect and I'm not into politics. The only thing I can respond is that a good business needs to respect laws. Mine certainly does.

Oh, and by the way, the US has such a great track record when it comes to the environment and human rights. Let's not practice selective history. Just think of Nagasaki and Hiroshima for a moment. So many innocent people were vaporized in an instant (after the war was practically won). Did you read about that? Or have you been too busy drinking lattes and walking around in Birkenstocks?

[znotlin]

so your answer is Hiroshima, let's throw in "the trail of tears" while you're on a roll. Does that affect Japanese labor rates, carbon footprint, and political discourse within Japan on a daily basis?

I'm just asking you a question. And trying not to spill my latte into the keyboard laughing.

No is a reasonable answer, and it is telling you cite law instead of what you believe is right and wrong. But I appreciate you treat your people well, maybe their kids will rebel and wear Birkenstocks.