Architects Sketches

JHalton · February 20th, 2004

Can anyone see a problem with asking Architects for A sketch of their design? Everytime.

Someone I work with has a problem with it. For some strange reason.

STRAT · February 20th, 2004

kingeldar · February 20th, 2004

does he know how to draw (usin hands and pencil) ???
lol

STRAT · February 20th, 2004

i always ask the architect for a quick sketch to make my life easier. they do it every time. bless their cotton socks.

Ernest Burden · February 21st, 2004

The other important thing about getting a sketch for a change or other-wise un-documented detail is creating a 'paper trail' of your instructions. This can be very useful to actually understand what they want, and show that you did what was expected if there is a dispute later. I hate to promote CYA thinking, but a covered A is best, in the end.

crazy homeless guy · February 21st, 2004

ernest is right in keeping a record like that. i work in a firm, so when a new project comes across my desk, i would rather look at the drawings, or a couple of sketches. make myself familiar with the project, then make a couple of my own sketches describing what parts i do not understand to whoever the designer on the project is. then they can give me sketches back, if they had different concepts of what it was/is.

if you are working for yourself, i would definitely take ernests approach. a sketch from the hand of the designer is hard to argue. i would make them sign and date the sketch also.

the only reason i would see someone being reluctant in sketching their design is if they do not fully understand it, and want to see it in computer model form to get a better understanding of it. then they will make changes based upon what you show them, causing you more work because it was not correct the first time... which isn't a big deal if you are at a firm, time permitting of course, but if you are contracted, you might be in the additional service area.

JHalton · February 21st, 2004

Quote:

what parts i do not understand to whoever the designer on the project is. then they can give me sketches back, if they had different concepts of what it was/is.

date the sketch also.

then they will make changes based upon what you show them, causing you more work because it was not correct the first time.

"then they will make changes based upon what you show them"!!!!! This is a big deal for me.

(before planning) Sometimes I work on a project and get to a 'modelling completed' stage and send them an image to 'annotate' for any changes.

They always take ages to get back to me and always do a return amendment when they do.

I do the change, go through the same process again and then theres 'more changes' and this goes on the further I get.

How can I stop this happening, how can I word it to make it sound like a really painful thing to do. *(This is obviously jobs that occur before planning in the UK)* (How is this dealt with in the US?)

Not had problems ever, with clients that have projects that have planning granted (even with the problem clients!)

Thanks geezers!

J

Chad Warner · February 21st, 2004

The only thing I could think of to stop this type of process is to state in the original contract that the architect is only allowed to make a certain number of changes to the design before they get charged for it. In my experience, 90% of the time when the architect sees their design in a rendered format they want to change it, so this is a good way to protect yourself from getting taken advantage of.

-Chad

Dibbers · February 21st, 2004

This happens to me all the time. Interestingly, it very rareley happened at all when I used traditional techniques. But as anoying as it is, I suppose from the architect's point od view, they are using the 3D model as a design tool. I don't mind one or two changes, but when it carries on, I say ' In order to complete this image on time, I need to commit to a design by this afternoon, even if the design continues to develop'.

kingeldar · February 21st, 2004

well i worked as an architect before cg (graduated architecte i am....)
i can tell you, most architects (in france idon't know somewhere else) don't even know how to use a computer
&
BELIEVE u only got to press da button to get that magnificient 3D =they don't realize we've got to work a bunch of hours to create that 3d with all it's nice materials & lights...

when u believe it ain't work WHERE'S DA PROBLEME ASKIN'FOR EVERLASTIN' CHANGES & corrections.....

February 20th, 2004	#1 (permalink)
JHalton Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Leeds Age: 30 Posts: 258 Name: J Halton	Can anyone see a problem with asking Architects for A sketch of their design? Everytime. Someone I work with has a problem with it. For some strange reason. __________________ Just ask. You never know!

February 20th, 2004	#2 (permalink)
STRAT Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK. Age: 36 Posts: 6,488 Name: Stephen Leworthy	eh? __________________

February 20th, 2004	#3 (permalink)
kingeldar Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Paris, France Posts: 323 Name: Steph deux	does he know how to draw (usin hands and pencil) ??? lol __________________

February 20th, 2004	#4 (permalink)
STRAT Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Cardiff, Wales, UK. Age: 36 Posts: 6,488 Name: Stephen Leworthy	i always ask the architect for a quick sketch to make my life easier. they do it every time. bless their cotton socks. __________________

February 21st, 2004	#5 (permalink)
Ernest Burden Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Ossining, NY USA Posts: 4,999 Name: Ernest Burden III	The other important thing about getting a sketch for a change or other-wise un-documented detail is creating a 'paper trail' of your instructions. This can be very useful to actually understand what they want, and show that you did what was expected if there is a dispute later. I hate to promote CYA thinking, but a covered A is best, in the end. __________________ Ernest Burden III AcmeDigital architectural rendering

February 21st, 2004	#6 (permalink)
crazy homeless guy Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: San Francisco Posts: 2,895 Name: travis schmiesing	ernest is right in keeping a record like that. i work in a firm, so when a new project comes across my desk, i would rather look at the drawings, or a couple of sketches. make myself familiar with the project, then make a couple of my own sketches describing what parts i do not understand to whoever the designer on the project is. then they can give me sketches back, if they had different concepts of what it was/is. if you are working for yourself, i would definitely take ernests approach. a sketch from the hand of the designer is hard to argue. i would make them sign and date the sketch also. the only reason i would see someone being reluctant in sketching their design is if they do not fully understand it, and want to see it in computer model form to get a better understanding of it. then they will make changes based upon what you show them, causing you more work because it was not correct the first time... which isn't a big deal if you are at a firm, time permitting of course, but if you are contracted, you might be in the additional service area. __________________ travis schmiesing

February 21st, 2004	#8 (permalink)
Chad Warner Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Savannah, GA Posts: 1,436 Name: Chad Warner	The only thing I could think of to stop this type of process is to state in the original contract that the architect is only allowed to make a certain number of changes to the design before they get charged for it. In my experience, 90% of the time when the architect sees their design in a rendered format they want to change it, so this is a good way to protect yourself from getting taken advantage of. -Chad __________________ _____________ Chad Warner www.bluelimestudio.com

February 21st, 2004	#9 (permalink)
Dibbers Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Leeds. UK Posts: 1,010 Name: Iain Denby	This happens to me all the time. Interestingly, it very rareley happened at all when I used traditional techniques. But as anoying as it is, I suppose from the architect's point od view, they are using the 3D model as a design tool. I don't mind one or two changes, but when it carries on, I say ' In order to complete this image on time, I need to commit to a design by this afternoon, even if the design continues to develop'. __________________ Hard boiled eggs and nuts....Mm! www.idenby.co.uk

February 21st, 2004	#10 (permalink)
kingeldar Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Paris, France Posts: 323 Name: Steph deux	well i worked as an architect before cg (graduated architecte i am....) i can tell you, most architects (in france idon't know somewhere else) don't even know how to use a computer & BELIEVE u only got to press da button to get that magnificient 3D =they don't realize we've got to work a bunch of hours to create that 3d with all it's nice materials & lights... when u believe it ain't work WHERE'S DA PROBLEME ASKIN'FOR EVERLASTIN' CHANGES & corrections..... __________________

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